EnMasse

[cueball]

I just wanted to say a few things.

I would like to be elected an EnMasse Global Forum Moderator. The reasons for this are many, but among them is the fact that when I came here as a Rabble Refugee, I really came because so many of the truly great charachters who made up Rabble/Babble came here to support Audra, and I really wanted to continue to be part of the community, and to see it grow.

I also thought is could be an interesting experiment in Internet Democracy.

So far in all of thsse discussion about the board, there has been a lot of discussion, and good jokes mind you, about process and how the Forum should be moderated in terms of mediating disputes and flame wars. This has all been very interesting and productive, however I think there should be more talk also about the general direction of the board, and the role of moderators in that, and so I would like to say a few things about how I think the board should evolve.

It may be the case that this whole thing goes up in a puff of smoke, and this seems as likely as not, but there have been some really great discussions of the boards potential, and many people have put forward some really great ideas, such as building a main page, with content from the forum members, and so forth. The amount of creative energy here is overwhellming, as the logo contest and naming contest have shown.

But amid all that there are some realities which I think should also be confronted, and one of those realities is that this board resides on JF's server, and we are using his bandwidth, and JF has graciously volunteered to allow us to do so but this situation can not go on forever, nor is it right for us to allow it to continue without either making a formal arrangement with JF, or making other arrangements.

I also think that there are some concerns tha I have about the result of the vote on the number of moderators, and I believe that, in fact, most people at Enmasse want more than three Global Moderators, and that after this election this issue should be rectified as soon as possible.

I think that all of the above are issues that people here should be thinking about in terms of the future of the board, and how it will work, or not work as the case may be. I also think that moderators can play a significant role in helping the board move forward on issues, and are not simply here to adjudicate disputes, but also to help move policy debates forward so that we do not get trapped in an endless circle of process debates with no resolution.

And as I guess efveryone knows I have opinions on those things, which I have outlined elsewhere. So, here are the things that I am thinking that as a moderator I would try and help build consensus and resolution on:

1) Expansion of the Global Moderating team to include more persons, with a possible system setting minimum standards for gender equity.

2) The creation of a main page web presence to express the views and debates that are happening in the community and elsewhere. The possible creation of an volunteer staff to co-ordinate this.

3) Trying to figure out how best to make the board financially stable and independent of the kindness of JF, who has done so much for us on faith alone, and the spirit of solidarity and goodwill.

I think that now that we have established the AUP and will have a new set of Global Moderators, that the immediate crisis is over, and we can spend some time hashing over these things and see where people want to go.

That is what I am thinking about.

In conclusion I would like to say, that however this turns out, whether the board succeeds or fails, this has been a great experiment in web democracy, even if trying at times, and I wish you all the best of luck.

PS: I am not now, nor have I ever beena member of the Communist Party, though I may talk like that sometimes.

[ephemeral]

I don't like speeches, so I didn't read most of your post, but you got my vote, Commie.
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and on that note...

[cueball]

But aren't you running yourself, I didn't realize until after I made this post.

Geeze this is exactly the problem with having only 3 Global Mods. I thought this would happen.

If I had only known, I would have thought twice about running against you.

[ephemeral]

Oh tish, a little competition never hurt anyone. Besides, there's room for both of us. I only want to do the global thing part-time.
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and on that note...

[cueball]

Well then perhaps we could run on a joint ticket, both as part-time but I don't think there is a process for that,.

[ephemeral]

okee doke. I can live with that.
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and on that note...

[goyanamasu]

cueball - you missed the 'cue' haha given by Tetanu that we need to have confidence that you are ready and able to break up fights real timely like. Put the question like this: in a good cop, bad cop shake-down with you and Tet on the force, which cop are you?
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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[VanLuke]

[cueball]

[cueball]

[goyanamasu]

[cueball]

Well I really apprecaite your point, and I think it is a very important point, but if I remove it now, this discourse will really make no sense at all, as two posters have referred to it, and then this excelent bit of critcism and history will be lost to the world.

So, I will apologize to whomever I have offended with this line, which is in fact a sarcastic parting shot in another war, a long long time ago, that is personal to me, and known to a few people here, and I hope they enjoy it for what it is..

Thanks for bringing all of that up. We all need to be reminded of these things.

Good night, and good luck.

[ephemeral]

[elmateo]

The Revolutionary Party of Elmateo? I can only see complete electoral failure. And thus Everyone should join.

[VanLuke]

[Jacob Two-Two]

I also disagree. Cueball's a firebrand, and he's definitely argumentative, but he's rarely unreasonable. I think he has the capacity to keep his moderator duties separate from his opinions. If not, hey it's only three months.

[VanLuke]

I most certainly hope that a moderator is never going to be a contributor to the thread s/he is moderating.

RB was a superb moderator (whatever else you may think of him) and he *never* wrote an opinion on the threads he moderated.

It would be taking sides and isn't that anathema to moderating?

[ephemeral]

[elmateo]

I don't think so. (at VL's post)

People are going to have opinions on everything here. Some may be weaker or stronger. Not the point.

Some people can seperate impartiality from their opinions. Others cannot. The good moderator is someone who will arbitrate fairly (period). Whether they have strong views on things should not be the issue. Its their ability to translate the AUP into a ruling that is just.

I certainly also don't want a robot for a moderator. No offense to those who see themselves as middle of the line characters. I would rather be governed by a human that I can get angry at and toss out than someone who is too bland to have anything interesting to get angry about .

[VanLuke]

ephemeral

If this is a dig let me tell you it wasn't obvious to me that you had gotten my point.

As to "the having discussed it ages ago": Excuse me for not having folowed all the threads.

Carry on.

I'm not sure I am going to bother and vote. So my comments don't make a difference. However, last time I looked I have every right of making them even if it was discussed before. (As if this was the first time something was brought up a second, third, fourth ... time)

[goyanamasu]

elmateo: That was so bland I'm having serious doubts about this revolutionary party of yours.

[elmateo]

it would be a toss of love.

[RealityBites]

[VanLuke]

[ephemeral]

[goyanamasu]

And now for something acutely important:

elmateo -- If you can line up all your candidates in a row like ducks, and then get cueball to step forward, here's what I want you to have him swear to (if you want our votes):

That he embodies the workingclass at its most embryonic stage of development on this board.

Got that? I'll be waiting. . . in the wings.


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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[RealityBites]

I expect the moderators here to take sides, if that means having and expressing opinions on the issues we discuss.

And when they make a moderating decision, they'll likely be taking sides there too, either between two members having a personal conflict, or siding with the board against a clear violator.

Except for The JF, who didn't post at babble, everyone who's been a moderator here, or who is running to be one, has some pretty well-known opinions.

[VanLuke]

[VanLuke]

[ephemeral]

[goyanamasu]

VanLuke : You are talking about 'justifying' what you say to a group of persons. It doesn't include everybody. And other people matter.

If the issue is with mods posting, then you make a distinction betw the sort of issue being discussed (here okay, there not); well, I'm wondering if this is not a question of the politics of the person.

In other words, if there's political differences (as there are with some candidates) it might (I say might) go better to get THOSE out in the open.

Suggestions. Maybe what you feel has much to do with what you believe in. If the beliefs are at issue, I for one think that can be dealt with in a different way.
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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[elmateo]

Just vote for me for some lowly moderation post and alll will be well.

not exactly sure what goyanamasu wants me to do though.

i don't have any candidates . The PRE is a pretty quiet party right now.

[goyanamasu]

pretty quiet party -- THAT'S WHAT I'm trying to say. Liven it up. Pick a few candidates. Make it party hardy.

Upthread all you need to do to figure out what I suggest is READ MY LIPS.
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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[cueball]

[goyanamasu]

Van Luke, Cueball. I took notes on the construction threads when we were starting out and I found Cueball's suggestion very valuable and convincing.

Cueball has put his pound of flesh into what EnMasse is today. I'll add that I saw nothing about building here that was conflictual. And I find it a plus that C held his own in disputes on babble.

Jeez, Cueball, I hope you don't see this as the Star Chamber or more than running for mod.
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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[VanLuke]

I never said otherwise (re the praise of Cueball).

So why are you addressing this to me?

[cueball]

No you didn't really. But you took the unusual and unprecedented step of respectfully telling me that I would not be good at the job. I don't think any other candidate has been so admonished by a fellow member.

Fair enough, and in fact I can see why you say what you are saying about me. I am often vocal in my opinions, and not everyone likes my opinions. It seems that you feel that my vocal stand on contentious issues make you think that I would not be unbiased enough to do the job of fair moderation.

I see this, but my point of view is that there is an inherent 'bias' in the idea that opinions that do not conform to the mainstream are biased, and the "centerist" position is not.

I on the other hand think my views are quite well reasoned, and also moderate, they are just not as popular as some other views.

[Cartman]

[cueball]

Most of those accusations are in keeping with the generally humourous nature of your campaign.

Seriously though, it was not suggested that your opinions would interfere with your ability to act fairly, it was only a question of what terms you would apply. I think it is a different thing altogther.

Anyway, it is small potatos really, I think that we are in all likelyhood going to end up with an excelent team of people, and that is an achievement all in itself, and the main objective of what we have been doing the last week.

All in all, I think there is a little bit too much of this gloom and doom feeling going around, due to the recent fighting, and not enough recognition of what has been achieved and the potential to do more. The fact that we are continuing and some of the positive spirit of the board had come back is really commendable.

[al-Qa'bong]

Since I usually miss the pertinent threads and discussions around this place, may I just say here that Cueb is one of the most thouhgtful, intelligent and judicious contributors I've seen either here or on babble, and that he would be an excellent moderator.

That said, anyone who would lower himself to campaign for this job is probably unworthy of holding it.
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"The purpose of government is to protect the weak from the powerful" Hammurabi

"We can't all be Sam the Sham; some of us have to be Pharoahs" Larry, brother of Darrel, and his other brother Daryl

[VanLuke]

[cueball]

Sorry you didn't get it. It is explained elsewhere.

[goyanamasu]

Cueball, have you ever read anything by Victor Serge? Quite interesting how he went from Fr anarchism into the Soviets just after the Russian Rev.
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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[cueball]

Yes and then into exile in Mexico in 1941. He was one of the lucky ones.

I think Serge is one of the great unsung literary heros of the early twentieth century, doing his best to remain involved and active but not recinding hie principles.

His letter to Trotsky on the Stalanist purges is really interesting:

[goyanamasu]

This is great. Do you have techie skills as well? You can run the show, read all my PMs, WTF. All power to Cueball !

Seriously, I'll read that post of yours right now.

After the election, I'd like a serious meeting in Hotel Algonquin (The Writer's Block thread) or in my private Mnemosyne's Sacophagus. I'm no expert on Serge, but we could chew the fat.
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Cat herders chatting over struggles . .
Writers offering editorial . .
Picnicking on common grounds . . .
. . . www.EnMasse.ca

[sparqui]