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Groping In Public

 
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DSquared
aka Aristotleded24


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Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:58 pm    Post subject: Groping In Public Reply with quote

Burnaby Mounties issue public warning:

Quote:
RCMP in Burnaby, B.C., are asking women in the Edmonds SkyTrain area to be on the alert for a serial groper believed to be 14 to 16 years old.

Ten women have reported being assaulted around the Edmonds SkyTrain Station on Kingsway since January, Cpl. Alexandra Mulvihill said Thursday.

The teenage boy targeted young and older women from different ethnic backgrounds at various times of the day, Mulvihill said.


So how widespread is this problem? Do anonymous environments like our major cities allow for this because the person wouldn't be known? Was it just more subtle back in the "good old days?"
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DSquared
aka Aristotleded24


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm surprised that nothing's been said on this topic so far. So, because I think it's important and would like to hear more,

*bump*
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Cartman
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if it was just more tolerated back in the day. Boys will be boys sorta thing?
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TS.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

None of my female friends have every mentioned experiencing anything like this to me.
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Simon Valle
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never heard of any case personally in Montral, nor even through the news. It must happen, but I think it's probably relatively rare.

However, if you want to be horrified, go search about the phenomenon of train gropings in Japan. Here's just a summary I found on the web:
Quote:
Chikan (Train groping)
# In Japan, more than 4000 men are arrested each year for groping on public transport.
# In 2001, a survey of two private high-schools in Tokyo revealed that more than 70% had been groped on the train.
# A recent survey of Japanese companies suggested that at least 17% of Japanese women have been groped in public.

http://www.japanfortheuninvited.com/articles/train-groping.html

It happens often in Japan, but I think the situation is different. For one, trains are more packed and therefore it's harder for women who don't want to cause a fuss to move away from a groper and even to turn around and to see their aggressor. Also, I think there's a significant cultural difference, women in Japan are culturally taught to be far more self-effacing and shy than women in the western world. How do Japanese react? Well, there's the government that is trying some women-only carriages (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women-only_passenger_car), then there's caf owners creating simulated trains where groping is permitted (http://www.kineda.com/japans-train-cafe-groping-allowed/) and then there's a few women who falsely accuse men to force them to pay them to avoid embarassment (http://www.alafista.com/2008/03/15/train-groping-scam/).
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Cartman
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TS. wrote:
None of my female friends have every mentioned experiencing anything like this to me.

If they have been in bars/clubs, my guess is that they have been groped.
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Tehanu
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been groped. Many women I know have as well. Simon is certainly right about Japan, that happened to me both in a crowded train (more than once), and another time in a totally deserted train when I was dozing and a man sat down next to me and started rubbing my leg, while rubbing himself. In the crowded train it might be hands, or a man rubbing his erection up against you.

And each time I felt violated, as well as scared in the case of the deserted train, and also ashamed that I didn't make a fuss.

But I've been groped in Canada, too.

I suspect that it's not reported a great deal because a) it's hard to prove and b) let's face it, women have been taught that that's just something we have to put up with, and c) there's a sense that nobody would take it seriously. Oh, and d) did I mention it's hard to prove?

I call to mind a time when I was a teenager on the bus (in Canada) and a guy was sliding his leg back and forth in contact with my thigh. Was that groping? Yeah, I think so, but the deniability factor would be high.

Ask around. I'll bet most women have had some kind of experience with groping.
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fork
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I find unusual is that 10 women saw fit to report the assaults:
Quote:
Ten women have reported being assaulted around the Edmonds SkyTrain Station on Kingsway since January, Cpl. Alexandra Mulvihill said Thursday.


HollabackNYC
Subway groping ad campaign:
Quote:
This week, news broke that the MTA's quiet preparation of an anti-groping subway ad campaign was put to a halt by MTA officials, even after they had developed mockups. The campaign was planned in response to a recent study by Manhattan Borough President Scott Stringer on sexual assault in the subway system - which found that 63% of respondents said they'd been harassed, and 10% said they'd been sexually assaulted.


Some of the 466 comments to this feministing.com post, Why "Hey Baby!" is a big deal:
Quote:
I remember the first time I got catcalled. I was 12 and walking to CVS with my friend. We were wearing huge winter jackets. A latino man, probably around 50, whistled and stared as he passed. I felt disgusted and bewildered, especially because I was only a 12 year old girl. It made me afraid to leave my house, since this happened on my street. I don't see how this can be taken so lightly by males AND females. When I got flashed on my way to school when I was 15, my mom was comforting but told me, frankly, that it's something that all women have to deal with. She told me stories about men masturbating on the DC metro into her jacket (it has happened to her twice).

Quote:
Interesting. I think about this issue everyday, as in my neighborhood (I am not exaggerating) I get harassed every five seconds on average, no matter what I wear and despite the fact that I am of average looks.

Quote:
Adam's Morgan is by far one of the most harasser-dense areas I have ever been to. At night, men reach out and grab your ass, your arms, and pinch you constantly. Because the streets and sidewalks are so crowded, you can't even confront or see your harasser. It's horrible!

Quote:
This is so timely, my boyfriend and I were just talking about it the other day. We often run together, but I was getting ready to go out by myself and mentioned that I wasn't going to run by the local (popular and crowded) beach because he wouldn't be there and I just didn't need the harassment that day. He couldn't believe it actually happened (probably because I look like a hideous purple-faced beast when I exercise) and then I realized just how often it does - and the shit I do to avoid it.

Quote:
Oddly enough, I've been talking about this a lot with my boyfriend recently, too. A lot of men just don't seem to be aware that it happens, or that it goes beyond construction workers whistling or something - he knew about, for example, Japan's problems with subway groping, but was astonished to hear that I've had the same thing happen here, more than once, on the DC Metro. It seems like a lot of guys think that incidents like that are isolated, freak occurrances, instead of being nonstop daily reality for a lot of women. Some of that may be due to the fact that at least in my experience, you get a lot less harassment if you're accompanied by a man, so they just don't see it as often.

Worst episodes I've experienced? Well, the dudes rubbing their crotches on my ass when the Metro is crowded definitely skeeve me out, but lately the creepiest thing happened at my favorite bar. There was this dude who was playing Creepy McGrabberson with all the women in the bar, who tried to force me to get up and dance with him, and when I refused, put out his hand like he was going to pat my shoulder in sort of an "oh, okay" fashion, but instead, grabbed my breast briefly, and then just turned and walked away. I think it was the walking away that made it even creepier - it was like he was saying "I can do this to you, and I don't even have to wait for your reaction".

Quote:
I was walking along the north side of Washington Square and a guy started laughing, making grunting noises and such. He then blocked my path and refused to let me pass. He was backed up by his buddies as well. The most frustrating thing for me is the memory of my doing nothing about it. I just kept my head down and hoped it would be over soon.

Quote:
I was trying to think of specific instances, but it's all so frequent it blurs together in my mind. I get told I have "joshing" lips (blowjob). I hate the random "accidental" gropings. I won't go out dancing due to the frequency of hard-ons pressed against me. But I agree with the poster who said the worst is the unapologetic leering.

Quote:
And yeah, in general I'm tired of the why did you go there/wear that excuse as I am with the men in my life - friends, partners, dad, brother, who don't get how demoralizing it can be. Like when I complained about all the harrassment in Italy and I get the "comes with the territory" type responses.

Quote:
I cannot get through a day without 2, 3, 5 cat calls.

Quote:
I've gotten catcalls since I started walking to middle school when I was 11.

Quote:
But in more seriousness: this is a HUGE problem all around the world. When I visit family in Pakistan, walking out of the house is pretty much declaring open season-- everything from inappropriate stares to rude, rude comments.

Quote:
In my old neighbourhood, there is a nasty little redneck bar just across the street from the local supermarket. To give you a general idea, this is the sort of bar where a smoking ban makes the air less breathable.

One night, I was walking home from the supermarket, where I'd bought myself ice cream and smokes. In order to get home, I had to walk in front of the aforementioned shitpit, where two drunk mid-20s white guys with at best questionable hygiene were laughing imbecilically. I remained impassive as I walked by them, as is my custom.

Just as I had gone one step past the two, one of them grabbed my upper arm quite hard. The two stood on either side of me.

The evening having reached that clearly auspicious point, they began to look me over quite closely, variously grunting. I jerked my arm out of the guy's hand and tried to proceed on my way.

No such luck.

The guy who had grabbed my arm now got right up in my face, and screamed, "WHAT, YOU WANNA TAKE A SWING AT ME, BITCH?" I decided that candour was not in my best interest; besides, I was at this point petrified beyond the point of responding at all. I just froze.

In what couldn't have taken more than a few seconds, though it felt like hours, I realised that these guys were clearly quite serious. I ran across six lanes of traffic, and was able at least to gain some distance from them, while they ran after me, the one who had grabbed me yelling "I'M GONNA FUCK YOU AND I'M GONNA KILL YOU."

I took a 45 minute detour home that night. Since then, I don't commit to a side of the street before assessing the available escape routes.

Quote:
Seems like I haven't had regular experiences of harrassment living as a woman in Northern Ontario. It could be the region but I've never been cat-called on the street, the city bus, at the mall, at bars, or at University.

Quote:
I was in a nightclub a couple of years back and trying to squeeze past some people at the bar to get through to the other room, but not having much luck.

This guy sitting at the bar grabs my arse and starts fondeling it, kneading it almost, fingers roaming. Because I was stuck in amongst so many people I couldn't get away from him, and couldn't reach behind me to do anything more than swat ineffectively at him. I had to stand there with him doing that until the folk in front of me shifted. He had plenty to say, too.

It still makes me feel sick to think of it.

Quote:
My worst was one of the first times. I was probably twelve, maybe thirteen, but definitely wearing a school uniform and carrying schoolbooks in a huge backpack. I was walking up 86th street in Manhattan some time in early spring when a man (white, late twenties, business suit, briefcase) asked me if I was cold. I nodded yes and began to cross the street, perhaps sensing something. As I walked away he shouted "What about your pussy? Is that cold too? What if I put my hot cock in it?" I remember getting home that night and crying in my room, staring at myself naked in the bathroom mirror, and writing what my responses to the pig should have been on my own flesh in permanent marker that took weeks to wash off. So on the racism front, nothing any man of any race has said to me has harmed me as much as what that clean-cut conventionally handsome man said. I was twenty four the first time I told anyone about that.

Quote:
This is the most satisfying post I think I have read on feministing, as this happens all the time to myself and my friends and leaves me always feeling enraged and helpless and disgusted. I am often shocked at the constant level of harrasment, and it leaves me furious that just minding our own business in public makes us fair game to these scummy, frightening men.
At worst, it has been flashing, groping, and men masturbating in front of me (generally while I try to get away.)

Quote:
When I was visiting England, my cousin and I were waiting for a play to start one evening, chatting by a fountain. We were both 16. A couple of men started yelling at us, and we ignored them. So they ran up behind us and pushed us both into the frigid water of the fountain.

Quote:
My worst bar harassment experience was when some frat boy douche stood behind me at a bar while i was ordering a drink and put his fingers inside my pants to feel what kind of underwear i was wearing.

Quote:
Don't know if anyone is still reading this... I live in Ottawa, Ontario which is a staid government town. Yet the frequency with which I get harassed amazes me sometimes -- almost daily.

Quote:
I got my ass grabbed in a bar by a very educated LLM student from a top 10 law school. I've seen frat. boys at top schools street harass.

Quote:
I go to one of the best universities in Canada. The students here are known to be pretty wealthy. This city is one of the most privileged areas in the country. And rest assured that there is PLENTY of street harassment going on downtown on the weekends.


Lastly,
Quote:
Being harrassed, for men, does not serve as a reminder that their personhood is located in their body or that the locus of their worth is their fuckability.

Honestly, there is a whole other layer to it above and beyone the fact that it is threatening.

I have this whole, rich intellectual life and subjective sense of self that being harassed on the street utterly undermines.

Notable for the response it elicited from a male poster:
Quote:
"Being harrassed, for men, does not serve as a reminder that their personhood is located in their body or that the locus of their worth is their fuckability. "

I would have phrased it a little differently, less extreme. . .
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Tehanu
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fork, I think that the comments section of that Feministing post should be mandatory reading for everyone. This divide between men's experience and women's reminds me of the famous Looking versus leering thread.

I read the whole Feministing comments section this afternoon, then met up with a friend for dinner and drinks, which involved walking through sections of downtown Toronto before and after. Meh, Toronto's a pretty safe city and normally I don't give it a moment's thought.

Dare I say it, though, I'd gotten so pissed off, that I was glaring at men, daring them to open their mouths or even look at me the wrong way. After reading those women's stories and remembering the many, many times I've been humiliated by total strangers, male strangers, acting as though they had every right in the world to comment on me, on my body, for me to gratify their need for attention, to play the submissive to them, for them to threaten me, to deny they were doing anything but a little harmless flirting when they'd scared the crap out of me ... well, put it this way, I had quite the head of steam worked up.

Fortunately, downtown Toronto is a pretty innocuous place. No noticeable looks, no comments. A good thing because I was loaded for bear, and they were going to be subjected to some SERIOUS FEMINIST ANALYSIS!

Or maybe the glaring was effective. Too bad I don't think I could (or want to) sustain it on a long-term basis.

While the Feministing thread focusses on street harassment, most of it would apply to either groping OR leering. It's a matter of degree.

The point is that women are being treated as objects. That men, when leering, making lewd comments, groping, are exerting their power over women.

Get this.

When a male stranger approaches me on the street, particularly when he makes a comment about my appearance, the first thing that I always have to assess is "IS HE SAFE?" Every single time that happens, there is going to be at least a frisson of fear.

So. If you're a guy, you need to know that you can cause fear in women.

Don't like it? Neither do I. There have been comments before that men do not like being thought of as potential harassers, gropers and rapists.

No shit.

I would be OVERJOYED if women never thought of men as potential rapists. It sucks, big time. Sucks for women, sucks for men.

What needs to change? Simple. Men need to stop raping, groping and harassing women. This is men's responsibility.

I am a white woman. Do I like it when someone who is black assumes I'm a racist because of the colour of my skin? Of course not. Do I know that every single black person in Canada has experienced racism? Yes. So on whom does the onus lie? On the black person to give me the benefit of the doubt, after having been betrayed so many times before? Or on me, to demonstrate that I'm aware of racism, to work against racism, to try to be an ally, to challenge individual and systemic racism when I see it?

Obviously it's my responsibility, not theirs.

Men, step up to the plate. It's not enough to not harass, grope or rape. You need to challenge harassers, gropers and rapists. And you need to understand that women experience fear of men, viscerally, no matter how strong and liberated and empowered and vocal we are. Because we've been harassed, groped, and raped.

And I am betting that just as I would say 100% of black people in Canada have experienced racism, 100% of women have experienced harassment and/or groping.

I'll bet that every single woman on this board could share a story of being groped. And I'll bet that every single woman that every man on this board knows, has had that experience. They might not be willing to share it, or they might even not think of it as being serious -- because we aren't TAUGHT that it's serious -- but I'll bet they've experienced it.

Think about that too.


... Seems I still had some steam left ...
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TS.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd like to clarify that it was never my intention to deny that groping happens. What I was fumbling for was my feeling that it is something that goes un/under-reported.
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peppermint
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

it's a commonplace thing in Asia, and the best defense I learned, in a packed subway car was to step backward- HARD! onto the guy's foot, as though you were about to lose your balance and caught yourself Twisted Evil
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Hephaestion
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yaa, I read that "comments" section last night, and it was an eye-full. Gawd, and some people wonder why many women have a gay man as a best buddy...
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anne cameron
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 26, 2008 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On an airplane, no less. Guy in the seat behind me leaned forward, hand through the gap between my seat and the one in the middle...my seat was back, I was trying to nap...so I grabbed his wrist, slammed my seatback upright, started yelling. Male attendant arrived on the run...they have a way of locking the seatbelt so the person can't get out... plane made an unscheduled stop in Calgary...groping Chummy was removed in handcuffs...flight continued...

NOISE, sisters. NOISE is our best defence, our best weapon. NOISE!
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fork
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hehe, that was great, anne!
Did the unscheduled stop/arrest make it into the paper?

Related to my previous link, not about groping, rather misogyny in everyday life. But similarly a post that prompted a deluge of personal accounts from women, and is at odds with the general public perception (and media presentation) of the amount of sexism today.
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anne cameron
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't see anything in the paper but I didn't have to go to court or anything, I just made a statement on the plane and signed it and the male attendant said he'd appear in court and testify as to where Chummy's hand was pinned by the now upright seat.

I don't "understand" groping nor do I understand why some guys get such a charge out of exposing their willies. When they expose themselves to little kids I feel as if we should help them...amputate the usually hidden member and hang it around their neck for all the world to see.
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'lance
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A friend of my wife's was groped on a city bus. She grabbed the creep's wrist, held his hand as far up in the air as possible, as though it were a detached object, and bellowed "HEY! I found this on my ass, does it belong to anyone here?" Guy blanched and slunk off the bus as quickly as he could, to jeers and derision from other riders.
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DSquared
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RCMP search suspected groper in Kelowna
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DSquared
aka Aristotleded24


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a story about another "charming" man from my part of the world:

Quote:
Winnipeg police have laid a list of charges against a 19-year-old accused of flashing women.

He allegedly exposed himself 10 times to women between Nov. 17 and Dec. 8, including one woman who was working out on a treadmill inside a city facility.


The article also mentions other charges as well, but I'm guessing that our female posters would confirm that it's also "respectable" citizens who do this kind of thing?
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DSquared
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another sexual assault on a woman in Winnipeg If you look at the comments, they are more along the lines of, "our streets are so dangerous because of all these crazy people walking around" as opposed to "something is wrong with a society where people feel it is acceptable to treat women in this fashion." This tells me that there is still a great deal of public education that is needed on this subject.
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Senor Magoo
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have no desire to grope anyone in public, but if I did, I'd make sure to get a Metropass every month, and then just ride the subway or streetcar. Riders are pretty much ordered to rub up against one another.
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Vundo Draxon
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DSquared wrote:
"something is wrong with a society where people feel it is acceptable to treat women in this fashion."


I don't think you will get anywhere with this statement. If you ask everyone "is groping women on the bus/train acceptable behaviour?" you will get zero positive responses (excluding trolls). I would therefore say the problem isn't that we see the behaviour as being acceptable.

Every behaviour has antecedents and consequences. I think we are really good at recognizing that this behaviour is bad and delivering negative consequences to those who do it. Where I see the problem is that we start at the behaviour without even thinking about the antecedents. It's not a matter of "Is sexual assault bad?" but "What is it in our culture that puts the idea in these guys' heads that they are above the laws/rules/social norms that the rest of us understand and abide by?" That's where I see some room for asking some potentially difficult questions that don't insult the intelligence of practically everyone by suggesting we think random groping is a-ok.
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Senor Magoo
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What social ill has ever been eradicated out of the sheer will of the public? Even "universal" taboos like incest and cannibalism still rear their ugly heads, and it's sure as hell not because everyone is "OK with it".
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DSquared
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vundo Draxon wrote:
Every behaviour has antecedents and consequences. I think we are really good at recognizing that this behaviour is bad and delivering negative consequences to those who do it. Where I see the problem is that we start at the behaviour without even thinking about the antecedents. It's not a matter of "Is sexual assault bad?" but "What is it in our culture that puts the idea in these guys' heads that they are above the laws/rules/social norms that the rest of us understand and abide by?" That's where I see some room for asking some potentially difficult questions that don't insult the intelligence of practically everyone by suggesting we think random groping is a-ok.


Just for example, how common is it for men to, when talking about women, say they want to "tap that ass?"
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Vundo Draxon
Leftist-rightie and rightist-leftie


Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1756

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DSquared wrote:

Just for example, how common is it for men to, when talking about women, say they want to "tap that ass?"


Very common, especially if you include the more subtle expressions of that sentiment. And where does it go from there in the overwhelmind majority of cases? Absolutely nowhere. How many of the guys who say that to each other and share a little chortle actually go in for the grope?

Could that mentality contribute to something more sinister? Maybe. But you'll have to come up with something better than some guys saying crude things = ready to commit sexual assault.
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Senor Magoo
He's got a big one


Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 8700

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I frequently say things like "I wanted to smack that guy!"

But I don't actually smack that guy. I'm also not "OK with" people smacking each other. And I certainly hope that when someone does smack someone else, they can at the very least take some kind of ownership of their behaviour instead of pretending that my empty comment somehow enables or encourages them.
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fork
Utensil


Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Posts: 1504
Location: Left . . . of the plate

PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vundo Draxon wrote:
DSquared wrote:
"something is wrong with a society where people feel it is acceptable to treat women in this fashion."


I don't think you will get anywhere with this statement. If you ask everyone "is groping women on the bus/train acceptable behaviour?" you will get zero positive responses (excluding trolls). I would therefore say the problem isn't that we see the behaviour as being acceptable.

What people think and what they say they think are often two different things. Some guys will cop to raping as long as you don't use the word "rape" when you're asking them. If you ask gropers whether groping women on public transportation is acceptable, there are sure to be some who will answer that it is not acceptable, while at the same time telling themselves that their groping was not groping, and that the thing that they did to that woman on the bus was "a compliment" or something. And if people's reaction to an 11-year-old being raped by 18 men can be to point out how she dressed and say, "these boys have to live with this the rest of their lives", then I have confidence in their ability to excuse any groping incident we can throw at them. To see this kind of thinking in action, see also cognitive dissonance or The Only Moral Abortion is My Abortion. So directly asking people if they think groping is acceptable will not ascertain whether or not "people feel it is acceptable to treat women in this fashion." The actual public response to groping - the minimizing, the denial, the inaction, the failure to recognize street harassment as part of rape culture (h/t to Corey) and part of normalizing violence against women - that signals a tolerance of such behavior that, at the very least, borders on acceptance.

Quote:
It's not a matter of "Is sexual assault bad?" but "What is it in our culture that puts the idea in these guys' heads that they are above the laws/rules/social norms that the rest of us understand and abide by?"

It is a matter of "Is sexual assault bad?". These guys are correctly interpreting what our culture tells them is acceptable.

Relinking Why "Hey baby" is a big deal from my 2008 post above because the link didn't work any more. And to requote:
Quote:
. . . he knew about, for example, Japan's problems with subway groping, but was astonished to hear that I've had the same thing happen here, more than once, on the DC Metro. It seems like a lot of guys think that incidents like that are isolated, freak occurrances, instead of being nonstop daily reality for a lot of women.

Hard to see how that's being "really good at recognizing that this behaviour is bad and delivering negative consequences to those who do it."
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Raos
volatilis vir


Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 5581
Location: Petropolis

PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Views from the Couch: You Didn't Thank Me For Punching You in the Face
Quote:
I am sure every girl can recall, at least once as a child, coming home and telling their parents, uncle, aunt or grandparent about a boy who had pulled her hair, hit her, teased her, pushed her or committed some other playground crime. I will bet money that most of those, if not all, will tell you that they were told Oh, that just means he likes you. I never really thought much about it before having a daughter of my own. I find it appalling that this line of bullshit is still being fed to young children. Look, if you want to tell your child that being verbally and/or physically abused is an acceptable sign of affection, i urge you to rethink your parenting strategy. If you try and feed MY daughter that crap, you better bring protective gear because I am going to shower you with the brand of affection you are endorsing.
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DSquared
aka Aristotleded24


Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 5748
Location: Winnipeg

PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carding the cat-callers
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