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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 24243
Location: Where the Wild Things Are...
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 Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 7:24 am Post subject: Republicans busted for homo sex |
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| Quote: | Titusville police say they have arrested Florida State Rep. Robert "Bob" Allen, of Merrit Island, on second degree misdemeanor charges for soliciation for prostiution.
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Officers say they noticed Allen acting suspicious as he went in and out of the men's restroom 3 times. Minutes later, he solicited an undercover male officer inside the restroom, offering to perform oral sex for $20. Officers realized he was a public figure after the arrest. |
*click*
Hey, just as I did with that asshole Foley, I will even defend Republicans from the homophobes. Don't the Florida cops have any *real* crimes to investigate?
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Last edited by Hephaestion on Tue Aug 28, 2007 1:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 1:21 am Post subject: |
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Oh, this IS interesting; I never realized the implications at first...
| Quote: | Washroom Sex Bust Blow To McCain Campaign
(Titusville, Florida) A co-chair of Sen. John McCain's presidential campaign in Florida has been busted for trying to pick up an undercover male police officer. |
It's still a bullshit charge, though. As Feral said, the real "crime" being committed here is that
| Quote: | | ... the price being negotiated is abusively low. While that in itself is not all that illegal, it probably ought to be. Just how abusively low this offer of $20 is depends a good deal on a picture of the undercover cop in question. I'd be willing to wager that the fair market value of the man's time would have been closer to $200. This is about as criminal as offering a dishwasher fifty cents an hour -- not entirely illegal, but surely criminal. |
ETA:
Bob Allen
Bob Allen's mug shot
Yeah, it'd take more than $20.00.
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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The Evil Twin
Stoned Immaculate
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
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Location: Toronto
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| Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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The low price ($20 - while there are guys whose prices that low, it's usually guys with serious substance abuse problems - usually crack or meth and you usually know right away) shoulda been a tip off that something wasn't quite right. In addition to being a Republican. he's also an idiot - or am I being redundant here? 
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Corey
Non-Threatening Boy
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 1972
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| Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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| Is everyone clear here that Allen was trying to sell his, Allen's, time to the undercover officer for $20? Not buy from the officer for $20. |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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Yup. But I still wouldn't let him -- not even for FIFTY bucks.
ETA: By the way, it wasn't just his time he was offering... he aspired to be a cock-sucker.
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The Evil Twin
Stoned Immaculate
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 3746
Location: Toronto
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| Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2007 1:16 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Hey, just as I did with that asshole Foley, I will even defend Republicans from the homophobes. Don't the Florida cops have any *real* crimes to investigate?
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Agreed, but these arrests do serve one purpose: they highlight the hypocrisy of the political class. Just once, Just Once, I'd like to see a politician who's been either caught or admits either having once done drugs or having solicited prostitutes - leftwing or rightwing, gay or straight - the list is endless (just for starters Barack Obama, George Smitherman, the many many clients of the "Washington Madam", Bill Clinton (though of course he didn't inhale - yeah right  , George Smitherman, Cheri di Novo, Andre Boisclair, Bob Allen....)...just once I'd like to hear one of them say:
| Quote: | | My own experiences show the hypocrisy of our drug and sex trade laws and the urgent need to reform them ASAP. Many people, most of them poor and persons of colour, have been arrested and have had their lives ruined for something that I either got away with or received a slap on the wrist for. My views on these issues have evolved. I now support a more progressive rehabilitation based approach to dealing with these problems rather than one based on outdated notions of punishment and Judeo-Christian morality. |
What are the chances any one of these hypotwits will ever say that? I'm not holding my breath.
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I can't support bike lanes. Roads are built for buses, cars, and trucks. My heart bleeds when someone gets killed, but it's their own fault at the end of the day. - Assclown Rob Ford |
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Hephaestion
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Location: Where the Wild Things Are...
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| Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2007 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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Allen pleads not guilty
| Quote: | State Rep. Bob Allen (R) has pleaded not guilty to charges he offered an undercover police officer cash for sex.
Allen, a longtime foe of LGBT rights in Florida, was not in court - opting instead to submit his plea in writing.
His attorney is expected to ask a judge on Monday to dismiss the case. If that is unsuccessful, the lawyer said he will submit a motion to have an audio take recording suppressed of an interview Allen gave to police following his arrest.
[...]
If convicted of solicitation Allen could face as much as one year in jail. |
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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Hephaestion
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Location: Where the Wild Things Are...
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| Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 1:50 am Post subject: |
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This is becoming so common that I changed the name of the thread...
Another GOP Lawmaker Busted In Washroom
| Quote: | Sen. Larry Craig of Idaho pleaded guilty this month to misdemeanor disorderly conduct after being arrested at the Minneapolis airport.
A Hennepin County court docket showed Craig pleading guilty to the disorderly conduct charge Aug. 8, with the court dismissing a charge of gross misdemeanor interference to privacy.
The court docket said the Republican senator paid $575 in fines and fees. He was put on unsupervised probation for a year. A sentence of 10 days in the county workhouse was stayed.
Roll Call, a Capitol Hill newspaper, which first reported the case, said on its Web site Monday that Craig was arrested June 11 by a plainclothes officer investigating complaints of lewd conduct in a men's restroom at the airport.
Craig, a social conservative, supported both attempts to advance a proposed constitutional amendment banning gay marriage and opposes adding sexuality to the groups covered under hate crime laws and to a bill protecting LGBT workers.
Craig said in a statement issued by his office Monday that he was not involved in any inappropriate conduct.
"At the time of this incident, I complained to the police that they were misconstruing my actions," he said. "I should have had the advice of counsel in resolving this matter. In hindsight, I should not have pled guilty. I was trying to handle this matter myself quickly and expeditiously."
[...]
He has been one of Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney's top Senate supporters, serving as a Senate liaison for the campaign since February. As word spread of Craig's guilty plea, a Romney campaign spokesman, Matt Rhoades, said in a statement: "Senator Craig has stepped down from his role with the campaign. He did not want to be a distraction and we accept his decision."
Mike Rogers, who bills himself as a gay activist blogger, published the allegations on his Web site, http://www.blogactive.com , in October 2006.
Craig hasn't said if he plans to run for a fourth term in 2008. An announcement was expected this fall. His spokesman, Smith, was uncertain if Craig's guilty plea would affect his re-election plans. |
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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Hephaestion
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The Evil Twin
Stoned Immaculate
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
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Location: Toronto
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| Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 3:13 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | This is becoming so common that I changed the name of the thread... |
I like the title change Heph. I have a feeling this thread will fill up with a WHOLE lot of Repug hypocrites in the next little while. 
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I can't support bike lanes. Roads are built for buses, cars, and trucks. My heart bleeds when someone gets killed, but it's their own fault at the end of the day. - Assclown Rob Ford |
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Doug
Fulltime enMasse Member
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| Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 6:16 am Post subject: |
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pogovio
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Joined: 16 May 2006
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Location: New York state
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| Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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Details:
It was just normal restroom behavior - the cop just misinterpreted it.
Craig to Hold Press Conference: Will He Resign?
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/Story?id=3533305
| Quote: | According to the arrest complaint, airport police Sgt. Dave Karsnia went into a stall shortly after noon on June 11 and closed the door.
Minutes later, the officer saw an older, gray-haired man, later identified as Craig, gaze into his stall through the crack between the stall door and the frame, fidget with his fingers and return to gazing through the stall for about another two minutes.
After a man in the adjacent stall flushed the toilet and left, Craig entered it and put his roller bag against the front of the stall door, "which Sgt. Karsnia's experience has indicated is used to attempt to conceal sexual conduct by blocking the view from the front of the stall," said the complaint, which was dated June 25.
The complaint said Craig then tapped his right foot several times and moved it closer to Karsnia's stall and then moved it into the area of the officer's stall to where it touched Karsnia's foot. Karsnia recognized that "as a signal often used by persons communicating a desire to engage in sexual conduct," the complaint said.
Craig then passed his left hand under the stall divider into Karsnia's stall with his palms up and guided it along the divider toward the front of the stall three times, the complaint said.
The officer then showed his police identification under the divider and pointed toward the exit "at which time the defendant exclaimed 'No!'" the complaint said. |
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pogovio
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| Posted: Tue Aug 28, 2007 9:18 pm Post subject: |
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I hope Craig doesn't resign. And I hope he runs again.
I think he would be the best possible opponent for a Democrat to run against in Idaho in 2008.
(Idaho is the #2 Mormon state (23%), after #1 Utah.)
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, the ignomy for a right-wing Republican... he's being compared to Bill Clinton!
| Quote: | Mitt Romney late Tuesday distanced himself from one of his top Senate supporters, comparing his actions to President Clinton's affair with an intern and a former Republican congressman's overtures to male teenage pages.
Sen. Larry Craig, R-Idaho, has pleaded guilty to misdemeanor charges stemming from complaints of lewd conduct in a men's room. Craig held a prominent role with Romney's presidential campaign, serving as a Senate liaison for the campaign since February. He resigned from the post.
[...]
"Yeah, I think it reminds us of Mark Foley and Bill Clinton," Romney said on CNBC's "Kudlow & Company." "I think it reminds us of the fact that people who are elected to public office continue to disappoint, and they somehow think that if they vote the right way on issues of significance or they can speak a good game, that we'll just forgive and forget."
[...]
While Romney said Craig "disappointed the American people," he didn't call on Craig to resign from the Senate.
"I haven't seen the allegations yet, I just heard that there was a guilty plea and he submitted a resignation as my liaison in the Senate," Romney said.
[...]
Romney, a former Massachusetts governor, has suggested stripping the federal pensions from those convicted of using their office to abuse the public trust. |
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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Ever at the forefront of titillation, ABC News discovers "cruising"...
Secret Signals: How Gay Men Cruise for Sex
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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Senate GOP leaders call for ethics probe of Craig
Chris Crain says:
| Quote: | We should take no joy in the ruin of Larry Craig's marriage and reputation — even if it is well deserved and a long time in coming. The man has known for two years now he was under intense scrutiny for rumors that he's gay and has sex in public toilets. Not since Bill Clinton have we been treated to a public figure so compulsively unable to control the little head with the big one.
But you won't find me arguing that somehow Larry Craig's self-destruction is an argument for my own equality. I can think of about 533 more effective arguments we could make that don't require someone else's ruin or suggest we all share some general (im)moral equivalence. Gay Americans are entitled to equal treatment and protection against discrimination whether or not every member of Congress who voted against gay rights has an utterly umblemished sexual history.
If Larry Craig really does troll public toilets for sex, it doesn't prove his "family values" rhetoric is claptrap anymore than Bill Clinton's infidelity proved his support for gay rights was the product of his promiscuity. The case for gay rights is compelling enough on its own merits. Let's not jump in the mud and join in the muckraking. |
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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Doug
Fulltime enMasse Member
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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Perhaps they'll make a documentary next. Oh well, saw this and thought it was funny.
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No Yards
Glutton for Punishment
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 2944
Location: Toronto Ontario
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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Ok, no doubt he was looking for a date, and he is a Republican, so he is a hypocrite, but the whole issue of arresting people for giving signals that they are open to having sex seems to me to be seriously fucked up.
Passing a law to make it illegal to be a hypocrite would make more sense than having a law that outlaws covertly signalling your sexual intentions.
If I covertly "signalled" to a woman at a "meat market", could I be arrested and charged with something?
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I follow, but more importantly, respect the Golden Rule. I fully and completely respect your right to be 'done on to' as you would 'do on to' others. |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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Exactly, No Yards.
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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Cartman
Beyond cuddly
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Location: OMG! They killed Jason Kenney!
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Public places like men's restrooms, in airports and train stations, truck stops, university libraries and parks, have long been places where gay and bisexual men, particularly those in the closet, congregate in order to meet for anonymous sex.
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Although the library would likely be empty, one would have to be pretty quiet.
Unfortunate that ABC did not spend more time talking about homophobia and why people like this remain in the closet. Instead, they talk about public sex like National Geographic describes the actions of rare animals. |
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Palamedes
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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Signalling an interest in sex should be perfectly legal, presuming it does not make one feel threatened or harassed.
However, I have no problem with it to be a crime to have sex in a public washroom. I do find that to be lewd and inapproporiate - whatever the genders involved.
Allegedly, the reason they were investigating the washroom was because they had received complaints about people engaging in sex in that particular washroom.
However, others have suggested that the washroom was merely used to communicate interest, at which point the patrons would then go elsewhere to engage in relations. |
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Cartman
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Location: OMG! They killed Jason Kenney!
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | However, I have no problem with it to be a crime to have sex in a public washroom. I do find that to be lewd and inapproporiate - whatever the genders involved. |
Maybe if it was legal, fewer people would get a rush from it. I doubt that it being illegal is going to deter those who already engage in it. Perhaps the bathroom looks good from the closet.
Several years ago when I lived in Winnipeg, I was at a large pub with a group of friends. After a few beer, I needed to make a donation at the restroom. While I was standing at the urinal, I heard a bunch of moaning and noticed two sets of feet in one of the stalls. It actually gave me a bit of a chuckle though it did not make for the best piss. What was hilarious though, was that every time someone exited the bathroom, the whole pub stopped, went silent and scrutinized the individuals leaving. The few people that had gone to the bathroom while they had sex managed to inform the entire pub in mere minutes. I admit to watching the door also, but I am not sure why. |
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No Yards
Glutton for Punishment
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
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Location: Toronto Ontario
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 7:03 pm Post subject: |
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Sex in a public washroom is illegal, but that's not what happened.
Yes, the intention was probably there, but while I may intend to hit 120KPh on highway 404 on my way home tonight, the police can not ticket me for hitting the "Submit" button for this posting.
ETA: can they?
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I follow, but more importantly, respect the Golden Rule. I fully and completely respect your right to be 'done on to' as you would 'do on to' others. |
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bshmr
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Joined: 22 Aug 2006
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Location: Central USA, Earth
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| Posted: Wed Aug 29, 2007 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| No Yards wrote: | | ... but that's not what happened.Yes, the intention was probably there, but while I may intend to hit ..., the police can not ticket me for hitting the "Submit" button for this posting. ETA: can they? |
Regard the ETA, yes but the charges may read like procuring or solicting which is not for the actaul act but the intnet. And, intending to drive the speed limit doen't usually work as an excuse; while, intending to violate the speed limit with impunity has costs when authorities are primed to pounce. |
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Tehanu
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Joined: 12 Apr 2006
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Location: Seceded from the Ford Nation
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 2:48 am Post subject: |
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Republicans are demanding Larry Craig's resignation. Now, is it because of his hypocrisy, or because he's gay (even though he says he's not)? Oh, right, it's because he pled guilty to something.
| Quote: | ... On Wednesday, Pete Hoekstra, a representative from Michigan, was first to call for Craig to step down. Senators John McCain of Arizona and Norm Coleman of Minnesota soon followed suit.
"Senator Craig pled guilty to a crime involving conduct unbecoming a senator," Coleman said in a written statement.
McCain argued that a senator should not be pleading guilty to any crimes.
... Republican Senate leaders issued a statement Wednesday explaining that Craig had "agreed to comply" with a request to temporarily step down from prominent Senate committees, including the veterans affairs committee.
While Craig was taking criticism from fellow Republicans, he was also attacked by gay activists, who said Craig is a prime example of hypocrisy — a man who they say engages in same-sex liaisons while consistently opposing gay-rights measures as a politician. |
CBC |
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Tehanu
More or less, more or less
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
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Location: Seceded from the Ford Nation
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:07 am Post subject: |
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Oh, and here's another bit of nastiness: Tucker Carlson bragging about him and one of his friends attacking a guy propositioning him in a bathroom. Now he's saying they "held" him.
But his original dialogue:
| Quote: | ABRAMS: Tucker, what did you do, by the way? What did you do when he did that? We got to know.
CARLSON: I went back with someone I knew and grabbed the guy by the -- you know, and grabbed him, and -- and --
ABRAMS: And did what?
CARLSON: Hit him against the stall with his head, actually!
[laughter]
CARLSON: And then the cops came and arrested him. But let me say that I'm the least anti-gay right-winger you'll ever meet --
[laughter]
CARLSON: -- but I do think doing this in men's rooms appears to be common. It's totally wrong, and they should knock it off. I mean that. I think it's -- I can't bring my son to the men's room at the park where he plays soccer because of all these creepy guys hanging around in there. I actually think it's a problem. I'm sorry. |
Chuckle, chuckle. 
MSNBC provided the following clarification from him:
| Quote: | Let me be clear about an incident I referred to on MSNBC last night: In the mid-1980s, while I was a high school student, a man physically grabbed me in a men's room in Washington, DC. I yelled, pulled away from him and ran out of the room. Twenty-five minutes later, a friend of mine and I returned to the men's room. The man was still there, presumably waiting to do to someone else what he had done to me. My friend and I seized the man and held him until a security guard arrived.
Several bloggers have characterized this is a sort of gay bashing. That's absurd, and an insult to anybody who has fought back against an unsolicited sexual attack. I wasn't angry with the man because he was gay. I was angry because he assaulted me. |
Not quite the same story, is it?
Media Matters, which has the video. |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 2:49 pm Post subject: |
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Barney Frank: Craig Shouldn't Resign
| Quote: | Barney Frank (D-Mass) one of only two openly gay members of Congress says that Idaho Republican Sen. Larry Craig should resist calls for his resignation.
"What he did, it’s hypocritical, but it’s not an abuse of his office in the sense that he was taking money for corrupt votes," Frank told the Associated Press.
"I think people should resign when they have clearly done the job in a way that is dishonest."
Frank went on to tell the AP: "It’s one thing to say that someone can’t be trusted to vote without being corrupt, it’s another to say that he can’t be trusted to go to the bathroom by himself."
[...]
"This is the hypocrisy - it’s to deny legal equality to gay people, but then to engage in gay behavior," Frank told the AP
Frank said that if Craig does stay on he would probably lose the GOP primary. |
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"The dignity of an animal is measured by his capacity to revolt in the face of oppression." -- Mikhail Bakunin |
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ronb
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Mitt Romney late Tuesday distanced himself from one of his top Senate supporters, comparing his actions to President Clinton's affair with an intern and a former Republican congressman's overtures to male teenage pages. |
Of course Romney, a craven opportunist with no discernable moral sense whatsoever, can't distinguish between propositioning interns and pages, which has a pretty distasteful abuse of power connotation, and propositioning strangers in a bathroom. |
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bshmr
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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Going back to Craig, after heraing about him and 'it' most of the day again.
My first impression was that he was akin to a rapist or dominatrix. Today, media is beating 'gay hypocritt' to death yet I don't hear of any relationships just illusions ot sexually gratifying manipulations (or distorted abuse). |
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Doug
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:10 pm Post subject: |
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What's so horrible about being a dominatrix? Some of my best friends are or were dominatrices.
Anyway...
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bshmr
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| Posted: Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:43 pm Post subject: |
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Craig may well be gay or, to my first impression, be simply a abusive, dominating sexual power-freak best understood as rapists are now.
Put another way, if one were male homosexual, one might prefer to distance and dis-associate from Craig because of what appears to be the self-serving and abusive nature of the man. There may be other alienating dynamics, which I don't intend to deny (such as honesty), but he comes across as primarily a narcisistic abuser. |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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Tape Released Of Senator's Police Interrogation
| Quote: | The officer who arrested Sen. Larry Craig in a police undercover operation at an airport men's room accused the senator of lying to him during an interrogation afterward, according to an audiotape of the arrest.
On the tape, released Thursday by the Minneapolis Airport Police, the Idaho Republican senator, in turn, accuses the officer of soliciting him for sex.
"I'm not gay. I don't do these kinds of things," Craig told Sgt. Dave Karsnia minutes after the two men met in a men's room at the airport on June 11.
"You shouldn't be out to entrap people," Craig told the officer. "I don't want you to take me to jail."
Karsnia replied that Craig wouldn't be going to jail as long as he cooperated.
The two men disagreed about virtually everything that had occurred minutes earlier, including whether there was a piece of paper on the floor of the stall and the meaning of the senator's hand gestures. At no time did Craig admit doing anything wrong, although weeks later he pleaded guilty to a reduced misdemeanor charge of disorderly conduct.
"You're not being truthful with me. I'm kind of disappointed in you, senator," Karsnia told Craig during the interrogation.
[...]
On the tape, Craig and the arresting officer can be heard arguing over what happened in the men's room minutes earlier. Craig acknowledges that the men's feet bumped, but says nothing improper happened.
"Did we bump? Yes, I think we did. You said so. I don't disagree with that," Craig said.
But Craig disputes the officer's account that he swept his hand under the stall next to him in an apparent effort to advance the encounter. They even disagree whether Craig used his right hand or his left hand.
Craig said he was merely trying to pick up a piece of paper - an account the officer disputes.
"I'm telling you that I could see, so I know that's your left hand. Also I could see a gold ring on this finger, so that's obvious it was the left hand," Karsnia tells Craig.
"Well we can dispute that," Craig says. "I'm not going to fight you in court. I reached down with my right hand to pick up the paper."
Karsnia said in a police report that he recognized Craig's hand gesture as a signal aimed at initiating sex. "It should be noted that there was not a piece of paper on the bathroom floor, nor did Craig pick up a piece of paper," he said in the report. |
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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
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Location: Where the Wild Things Are...
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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Kevin Naff:
| Quote: | Idaho Statesman reporter Dan Popkey is all over the news this week, following publication of his long-awaited outing piece on Sen. Larry Craig. Roll Call beat the Idaho paper to the punch with its report earlier this week on Craig’s arrest and guilty plea stemming from the now infamous restroom incident. But Popkey had spent months investigating the rumors of Craig’s homosexuality, which date back to at least 1982. In December, Popkey visited me at my Blade office in D.C. to ask whether I knew anything about Craig’s sexual orientation.
We spent about an hour talking about his assignment, which clearly made him uncomfortable. Here is an account I wrote about our encounter that was published in the Blade in December 2006: |
read it @ the link...
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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 24243
Location: Where the Wild Things Are...
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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A sympathetic homophobe?
| Quote: | Sgt. Dave Karsnia shielded the men he arrested in the airport bathroom from embarrassment.
After he flashed a badge, he would point silently to the exit. When one man said his wife was waiting at a gate, Karsnia called for a citation book to spare the man a trip to the airport police station.
And when his bathroom stings netted a U.S. senator from Idaho, he even promised him, "I don't call media."
That promise - which Karsnia seems to have kept - didn't do Sen. Larry Craig much good.
Craig's arrest was surely the biggest of Karsnia's career, but it was only one of more than a dozen he made in the Minneapolis airport's restrooms this summer.
Just 29, his record has been that of a rising young officer. He joined the Minneapolis Airport Police in 2000 as a community services officer, just out of college. Three years later, he was named the department's Officer of the Year, and in 2005 he was promoted to sergeant. Last year, he finished his master's degree.
The last time Karsnia was in the media spotlight, it was because of his efforts to get speeding electric carts carrying passengers and luggage at the airport to slow down. The issue came to light last year when a young boy was run over and dragged by a cart and suffered a second-degree carpet burn.
Karsnia was in charge of cart enforcement at the time. That got him on ABC's "Good Morning America" earlier this year. |
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Hephaestion
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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A debate over outing
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Cartman
Beyond cuddly
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 8635
Location: OMG! They killed Jason Kenney!
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Meanwhile, people who aspire to live in the public eye will realize they have to live honestly and openly, and that is happening in Hollywood (Neil Patrick Harris, T. R. Knight, etc.) as well as Washington these days.
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The above was used as a reason for outing or reporting as it was put. I wonder if the logic is correct. If reporters dig into the personal lives of politicians and routinely reveal their orientation, will this create a more open society, or will it create more homophobia? It is one thing to say Hollywood actors can live open lives, but is it not quite different in some of these ultra-Republican states? That is, will not gay politicians just be turfed? |
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Holmes
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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A Sting He Didn't Deserve
By Aaron Belkin
Washington Post, Saturday, September 1, 2007; Page A25
"Sen. Craig, who voted to enact "don't ask, don't tell" in 1993, got caught up in a system that looks a lot like the one he helped create, a system in which innocent gestures can invite punishment."
Interesting article with some historical information found in the Opinions www.washingtonpost.com |
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bshmr
Fulltime enMasse Member
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No Yards
Glutton for Punishment
Joined: 11 Apr 2006
Posts: 2944
Location: Toronto Ontario
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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Craig is on live right now resigning ... as of Sept 30th.
When he actually used the words "I am resigning", there was a small interruption caused by cheers from the crowd.
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I follow, but more importantly, respect the Golden Rule. I fully and completely respect your right to be 'done on to' as you would 'do on to' others. |
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voice of the damned
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Location: slandered, libeled
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Not that it's a major issue, I'm just kind of wondering. Does anyone happen to know how he ended up in the Minneapolis airport? I'm assuming that he was either visiting the city, or transferring flights. If the former, what were his reasons for going there? And if the latter, where was he coming from and where was he going? |
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Tehanu
More or less, more or less
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
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Location: Seceded from the Ford Nation
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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He's still not gay, by the way.
| Quote: | ... “For eight months leading up to June 11, my family and I have been relentlessly and viciously harassed by the Idaho Statesman," he said.
"Let me be clear: I am not gay, I never have been gay," Craig said in a televised statement earlier in the week. "I did nothing wrong at the Minneapolis airport."
... Craig had been a vocal opponent of gay rights in the U.S. and represents one of the most senior voices in the conservative wing of the Republican party. |
CBC |
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Solidarity4Ever
*BANNED*
Joined: 31 Aug 2007
Posts: 13
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Tehanu wrote: |
He's still not gay, by the way.
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Maybe he's bi? Ever think of that? Would that make him a pioneer? A hero, if you will. Maybe the greatest American hero of all time. Barney Frank times 1000. |
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bshmr
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Location: Central USA, Earth
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| Posted: Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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a) Minneapolis is the primary Northwest Airlines hub. Other airlines have their mid-west hubs in Dallas (Texas), Denver (Colorado), & Saint Louis (Missouri) meaning that depending on the major airline travel will be through one of those airports. So, I imagine that Craig was en route via NW (Airline) and possibly a smaller 'feeder' carrier to/from Idaho. I speculate there is a limited number of flights to and from Boise (or where-ever in Idaho) which would mean longer than two-hour lay-overs/waits. [One could check, by day of the week]
b) I will second the 'bi-sexual' label for Craig, though not typical. I will repeat that my speculation and his public image is that he lacks genuine relationships apparently throughout his life. That is, he seems to me to fit into an aversive sub-set of 'bi-sexual' or 'pan-sexual'. I will close with former USAn Senator Jean Carnahan's describing Craig as 'lusty' which is note worthy, IMO. |
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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:25 am Post subject: |
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The Nation
| Quote: | I didn't stress this in my last post on Craig--because I didn't think I'd have to--but such dragnets are not only motivated by homophobia, but are practically, if not technically, police entrapment. They're a legacy of a pre-Lawrence legal order that criminalized sodomy, and they endure to this day because gay sex, even and perhaps especially the suggestion of its solicitation, is still seen as violation of the norms of public life.
Heterosexuals routinely use public space and the internet to solicit sex from each other; sometimes this sex is among perfect strangers or in public (or quasi-public) itself. Unless they involve minors, none of these practices are the subject of undercover busts. Instead they're romanticized (teenage makeout sites), tolerated as nuisances (bad pickup lines, whistles, Lindsay Lohan) or generally treated as vital, sexy aspects of modern social life and economy.
Just once I'd like to see the script flipped. Why don't the Minneapolis police post undercover female cops at airport bars who gesture provocatively towards the bathroom and then arrest any man who follows? Using newfound, post-9/11 surveillance powers, law enforcement should determine the identities of everyone who posts details of their sexcapades on www.milehighclub.com. These are dangerous, lewd heterosexuals who have admitted to having had actual sex--not in the airport--but on the airplane! Baby-faced, 21 Jump Street-type cops should be assigned to every high school to offer blowjobs to jocks underneath the bleachers. Anyone who shows up at the designated coordinates should be arrested. Depending on the jurisdiction, some arrestees may even get their names permanently listed on sex offender registries! The entire city of Myrtle Beach should be staked out for the month of March. And don't even get me started on the subject of Craigslist. |
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voice of the damned
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| Posted: Sun Sep 02, 2007 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | a) Minneapolis is the primary Northwest Airlines hub. Other airlines have their mid-west hubs in Dallas (Texas), Denver (Colorado), & Saint Louis (Missouri) meaning that depending on the major airline travel will be through one of those airports. So, I imagine that Craig was en route via NW (Airline) and possibly a smaller 'feeder' carrier to/from Idaho. I speculate there is a limited number of flights to and from Boise (or where-ever in Idaho) which would mean longer than two-hour lay-overs/waits. [One could check, by day of the week]
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Thanks. I knew Minneapolis was a Northwest hub, but I thought that might be only for flights going into the USA from other countries. |
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Doug
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| Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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The blogger that outed Senator Craig isn't done yet.
| Quote: | In the coming months, he plans to post the names of "a few more" closeted Congress members on his blog, he says, all of them Republicans. There are 33 names on his published list, most of them men, 30 from the GOP. That fact reveals more about the Republicans, he says, than about him. Although a registered Democrat, he says he is bipartisan.
"I write about closeted people whose records are anti-gay," he says. "If you're a closeted Democrat or Republican and you don't bash gays or vote against gay rights to gain political points, I won't out you." |
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/03/AR2... |
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pogovio
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Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 900
Location: New York state
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| Posted: Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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America's Toe-Tapping Menace
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/02/opinion/02macdonald.html
| Quote: | WHAT is shocking about Senator Larry Craig’s bathroom arrest is not what he may have been doing tapping his shoe in that stall, but that Minnesotans are still paying policemen to tap back.
| The arresting officer wrote: | Craig tapped his toes several times and moved his foot closer to my foot. I moved my foot up and down slowly.
(From the police report) |
In 1970, Laud Humphreys published the groundbreaking dissertation he wrote as a doctoral candidate at Washington University called “Tearoom Trade: Impersonal Sex in Public Places.” ... In minute, choreographic detail, Mr. Humphreys (who died in 1988) illustrated that various signals — the foot tapping, the hand waving and the body positioning — are all parts of a delicate ritual of call and answer, an elaborate series of codes that require the proper response for the initiator to continue. Put simply, a straight man would be left alone after that first tap or cough or look went unanswered. Why? The initiator does not want to be beaten up or arrested or chased by teenagers, so he engages in safeguards to ensure that any physical advance will be reciprocated. As Mr. Humphreys put it, “because of cautions built into the strategies of these encounters, no man need fear being molested in such facilities.”
...
As for those who feel that a family man and a conservative senator would be unlikely to engage in such acts, Mr. Humphreys’s research says otherwise. As a former Episcopal priest and closeted gay man himself, he was surprised when he interviewed his subjects to learn that most of them were married; their houses were just a little bit nicer than most, their yards better kept. They were well educated, worked longer hours, tended to be active in the church and the community but, unexpectedly, were usually politically and socially conservative, and quite vocal about it.
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Mr. Humphreys even anticipated the vehement denials of men who are outed: “The secret offender may well believe he is more righteous than the next man, hence his shock and outrage, his disbelieving indignation, when he is discovered and discredited.”
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Public sex is certainly a public nuisance, but criminalizing consensual acts does not help. “The only harmful effects of these encounters, either direct or indirect, result from police activity,” Mr. Humphreys wrote. |
Our cops have more important things to do.
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Doug
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 11:55 am Post subject: |
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I'm going, I'm going...wait, no I'm not!
| Quote: | Sen. Larry Craig of Idaho may reconsider his resignation if he is cleared of a disorderly conduct charge to which he pleaded guilty last month, his spokesman told CNN on Tuesday.
Dan Whiting said it was still the GOP senator's intention to resign effective September 30, "however, he is fighting these charges and should he be cleared before then, he may -- I emphasize may -- not resign." |
Why he thinks he still has the option, I don't know.
Also had a nice LOL at this:
| Quote: | | Idaho Gov. Butch Otter |
It really is too late, there's a song:
Tap three times with your loafer if you want me!  |
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Hephaestion
Deeply Shallow
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Location: Where the Wild Things Are...
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| Posted: Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:38 pm Post subject: |
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Blogger promises more closeted Republicans to out
| Quote: | Soon, a new name will pop up on Mike Rogers's hit list. Larry Craig wasn't "the first on my list," the gay blogger says. And the Idaho senator, who announced his resignation Saturday, "won't be the last."
Rogers, sitting on a club chair in his Northwest Washington apartment, is basking in the attention. For three years now, he's been a feared one-man machine, "outing," he says, nearly three dozen senior political and congressional staffers, White House aides and, most damagingly, Congress members on his blog. On Capitol Hill, a typical phone call from Rogers -- "Are you gay?" he'd ask -- is "a call from Satan himself," says a former high-ranking congressional staffer whose name is on the list.
Rogers reasons that there's justice behind his tactics -- "odious," "outrageous" and "over-the-line" as they might seem to his detractors. |
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